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Lammerlaws treasures - relics of the Goldfields...plus Gold finds.

Lammerlaw		Posted : Monday, 30 January 2012 9:08:32 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Because I mentioned Stevens Favorite rifles in the preceeding posts it might be timely to consider the foods of the gold fields and what miners ate. The history of the ogld fields is usually devoted to 'looking for gold' and forgets to mention such things as equipment, foods and beverages - though the latter can well be guessed! Few people know that in Central Otago miners took cats because of the problems with rats at one stage and few people know that miners also took rabbits as a sounrce of food - I never read that in any gold mining book but it is mentioned in the book 'Exotic Intruders' that 'Gold prospectors carried them in large numbers into Central otago releasing them onto the goldfields' - this actually stands to reason because if anything bred 'like rabbits' then Rabbits did! Because of the influx of rabbits - which were in truth introduced into Otago long before the goldfields came into being .22 calibre rifles quickly found their way into Central so that one of the sources of food during the days of the huge dredges and the dredging boom was definitely rabbits and for that reason we shall have a look at two of the most popular rifles of the 1890s, rifles which became common in Otago and can still be picked up now and again from old families who have told me that Great grand dad used it to shoot rabbits when he was gold mining or when he was rabbiting.

diggerjoe		Posted : Monday, 30 January 2012 1:20:30 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Nugget Groups: Registered Joined: 21/09/2011(UTC) Posts: 36 Thanks: 24 times Was thanked: 23 time(s) in 15 post(s)		I would certainly be interested in finding out the year the Winchester was made. The model is a 1906 and the serial number is 349907 and one one of the serial numbers had a B below it. Hope that helps.

Lammerlaw		Posted : Monday, 30 January 2012 1:34:01 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Originally Posted by: diggerjoe I would certainly be interested in finding out the year the Winchester was made. The model is a 1906 and the serial number is 349907 and one one of the serial numbers had a B below it. Hope that helps. If you researched the rifle you would find that it is listed as having been made in 1913 and that is its official manufacturing date but the actual receiver was made about two thirds of the way through November in the year 1912. It is also the 'Intermediate variety, first variation' - there were three varieties - in the first variety there were two variations, in the Intermediate variety there were four variations and in the late variety there were three variations.

Lammerlaw		Posted : Monday, 30 January 2012 2:38:52 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		These little rifles were popular amongst both boys and adults and I have seen many in the trips around Central Otago - this is a Model 1894 Stevens Favorite and they are indeed a favourite (note spelling) - This one was retailed by A & W McCarthy of Dunedin and turned up in the hands of an old Central Otago gold mining family who told me that their grand father used it to keep the family supplied with rabbits when the 'gold mining was lean' - in other words not getting anything much. The interesting irony is that this little rifle is not in .22 calibre but rather .25 rimfire and this was a popular calibre once upon a time. This particular rifle would have been one of the very first Model 1894 Stevens Favorites to ever come to New Zealand - its serial number in the 40,000 range makes it one of the first 1894s - it also has 14 differences between it and any other 1894 I have ever seen. It is interesting to note that these little rifles came out in .22 rimfire, .25 rimfire and .32 rimfire and it is not unusual to find them in any of those chamberings The high serial number does not indicate the 40,000 Stevens Favorite made but rather the 40,000th Stevens firearm made because at one time all firearms produced were numbered in the same serial number range...If you tell me you have one older because it is serial numbered M 674 then sorry to relate the three digit numbers prefixed with a letter came later AND the letters were not issued in order so that an L prefix could have been made before the D prefixes! Life sure gets complicated! In any case this gun was used on the goldfields so could be considered a 'Goldfields relic' If anyone has one of these rifles in better condition that they would be prepared to part with then let me know as I am keen on them., Edited by user Tuesday, 31 January 2012 10:06:04 PM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified Lammerlaw attached the following image(s):

Lammerlaw		Posted : Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:43:11 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Another Stevens Favorite with Central Otago Connections - strangely enough it is not a .22 either but rather a .32 rimfire! This rifle would have come to New Zealand right toward the end of the last of the goldfields booms - the era of the huge gold dredges. This is a typical 1894 Stevens and has fourteen differences between it and the early one above. Together with the rifle is the largest nugget I ever found on one of our claims. The rifle and quarter pound nugget which is sitting on the top of a clay top for a Chinese dried vegetable container give some idea of comparative sizes. Edited by user Wednesday, 1 February 2012 8:45:41 PM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified Lammerlaw attached the following image(s):

mineforgold.co.nz		Posted : Wednesday, 1 February 2012 10:06:25 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 14/11/2011(UTC) Posts: 299 Location: Nelson Thanks: 58 times Was thanked: 38 time(s) in 35 post(s)		I bet there was a party that day!
		Own: Lobo SuperTraq, Garrett ATPro, Minelab Excalibur
		WWW BLOG

Lammerlaw		Posted : Wednesday, 1 February 2012 10:20:36 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Originally Posted by: mineforgold.co.nz I bet there was a party that day! No party because it took me so long to accept the fact that it was real that by then the novelty had worn off - all the way back up the river I kept throwing it twenty five or so yards ahead of me so I could walk up to the golden glint...looked great shining from afar!

chrischch		Posted : Thursday, 2 February 2012 12:25:27 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 28/08/2011(UTC) Posts: 811 Location: Christchurch Thanks: 192 times Was thanked: 105 time(s) in 104 post(s)		Now that's a nugget!
		Fisher Goldbug Pro, Fisher F2, Garrett Propointer.

gjj109		Posted : Thursday, 2 February 2012 9:55:38 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Medals: Groups: Registered Joined: 14/03/2011(UTC) Posts: 464 Location: Thames Thanks: 217 times Was thanked: 194 time(s) in 115 post(s)		That would have been a good day. If you found a similar one tomorrow, would you keep it, would you sell it, or would you swap it for..........?

Lammerlaw		Posted : Thursday, 2 February 2012 11:31:13 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Originally Posted by: gjj109 That would have been a good day. If you found a similar one tomorrow, would you keep it, would you sell it, or would you swap it for..........? If I found another one? - I guess I would keep it even though I dont see them often as I keep most of my gold in safe deposit now days. I want my kids to get what I have when I curl up my toes. If anything came up I desperately needed like an original cased Colt Navy then I would trade smaller gold. Edited by user Thursday, 2 February 2012 11:31:57 AM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified

Lammerlaw		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 11:27:30 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Although I had intended keeping this strictly to the relics of the goldfields and not to the differences between different guns I am including the two Stevens rifles together for two reasons - one is merely a matter of interest for anyone here who might be interested in these old heaters and two formy own benefit - If anyone has an old Steves then I am interested and if they have one of hte early ones I am evenmore interested! Tor this reason I am placing the photo of these two early Goldfield family firearms on together so that the differences can be seen - if anyone has one of these old rifles and particularly the older one then I would love to hear from you...and maybe try to do you a deal. The most obvious difference is the shape of the receiver where the barrel touches the breech block - in the older rifle at top the receiver has a sharp right angle and in the later rifle at the bottom the receiver is rounded. Edited by user Friday, 3 February 2012 11:31:27 AM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified Lammerlaw attached the following image(s):

chrischch		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 2:17:57 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 28/08/2011(UTC) Posts: 811 Location: Christchurch Thanks: 192 times Was thanked: 105 time(s) in 104 post(s)		They are definately very similar. You would have to know your stuff to deal in these I bet.
		Fisher Goldbug Pro, Fisher F2, Garrett Propointer.

chrischch		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 2:24:27 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 28/08/2011(UTC) Posts: 811 Location: Christchurch Thanks: 192 times Was thanked: 105 time(s) in 104 post(s)		Can you get the ammo nowadays easy enough for those calibres?
		Fisher Goldbug Pro, Fisher F2, Garrett Propointer.

Lammerlaw		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 3:18:53 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Originally Posted by: chrischch They are definately very similar. You would have to know your stuff to deal in these I bet. Yes they are almost the same but not quite - strangely enough no one in the world knows all that is to be known about Stevens Favorites including nummber made as the records were destroyed - the two old rifles shown do have fourteen internal and external differences tohugh and the receiver shape is the most outwardly obvious one...I will try to get a couple more photos on and then you will see

Lammerlaw		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 3:45:07 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Originally Posted by: chrischch Can you get the ammo nowadays easy enough for those calibres? .25 rimfire and .32 rimfire are near impossible to get now but I still have many packets - enough for a few trips bunny shooting BUT the ammo is now fetching big money in the gold Old US of A For you chrischch I have added these photos so you can see some of the differences and also some early sealed packets of ammo and some later ones which are about WWII vintage and up to the 1960s. Ironically enough I once found some of the old red .25 rimfire packets in an old miners hut away up in the hills but not collectible as they were puckerood. The top right hand packet is around 1900 and the other smaller red packets are around 1910...any packet marked Union Mettalic Cartridge Company only and not Remington UMC predates 1908, The green Winchester packet is dated October 1911 so also an early packet and still as new and sealed 100 years later . Edited by user Friday, 3 February 2012 5:34:42 PM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified Lammerlaw attached the following image(s):

chrischch		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 6:22:50 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 28/08/2011(UTC) Posts: 811 Location: Christchurch Thanks: 192 times Was thanked: 105 time(s) in 104 post(s)		Thanks for that. Those boxes of ammo are damn cool. I love the old packaging. I have old car parts in similar boxes. I do love the great engineering involved in those guns. I would love to learn from an (older) gunsmith.
		Fisher Goldbug Pro, Fisher F2, Garrett Propointer.

Lammerlaw		Posted : Friday, 3 February 2012 11:11:04 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Originally Posted by: chrischch Thanks for that. Those boxes of ammo are damn cool. I love the old packaging. I have old car parts in similar boxes. I do love the great engineering involved in those guns. I would love to learn from an (older) gunsmith. I have no idea where they are but I do have a large pile of old car owners handbooks from the WWII through to MkI Zephyr era and a fair few old Motorbike ones plus a heck of a lot of old tools - carpentry and metal work - I bought an entire garage owners lot once, all old stuff but good stuff, Britool etc - come to think of it I have the front windscreen for a 3L Rover and a back one for a 1956 Ford Customline - I got stuff lying everywhere!

Lammerlaw		Posted : Sunday, 5 February 2012 7:00:26 PM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		Another of the rifles which were a favourite with those who supplemented the table with rabbit toward the end of the nineteenth century is the 1890 Winchester - as its a Gold fossicking forum I shant tell the complex history of this rifle but it would be physically impossible for any human being to build up a collection of every different variety of this one model alone. A treasured photo I have here somewhere shows a crew member of one of Central otago's gold dredges holding a Model 1890 Winchester. Unlike the single shot Stevens favorite the Winchester Model 1890 was a pump action repeating rifle - originally the pump action repeater was called the 'Haveness action' by Andrew Burgess then it became known as the 'Trombone Action' and Pump Action. The following photos show the Model 1890 Winchester a favourite rifle of the later Goldfields era and during the era of the rabbiters. Once again if anyone has one of these rifles in better than average condition that they are prepared to part with...then let me know, I would love to hear from you. I also include some gold I got a couple of weeks ago from a favourite spot of mine - about 50 grammes. The photo was taken as the Gold sat in yet another goldfields relic...but more about that later. Edited by user Sunday, 5 February 2012 9:13:30 PM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified Lammerlaw attached the following image(s):

Lammerlaw		Posted : Thursday, 9 February 2012 10:45:33 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Groups: Registered Joined: 24/05/2011(UTC) Posts: 1,721 Thanks: 72 times Was thanked: 579 time(s) in 396 post(s)		A break from Gold fields guns and back to tools - over the years I have picked up many dozens of gold miners tools. Generally speaking they were just disgarded wher they wore out or broke or were of no further use. Tools which were still of use to either the miner themselves or to someone else were often left safely stored somewhere - on two occasions I have picked up tools in caches under rock overhangs or shallow caves - whether the miner intended to come back or whether he left them for someone else in the future will never be known. On several other occasions I have found tools stacked neatly outside the hut and in one case found a whole array of shovels, picks and so on stacked together against what had once been the chimeny, long since eroded away to cover the tools completely. These are two hammer/picks and I assume would have been used to break up larger rocks or for hammering coal chisels into rocks to split them to facilitate ease of handling. The larger one was obviously discarded as it has been split form the hammer head down the side and had become dangerous to use as further use could have made pieces shatter off it. The nugget of Gold was picked up by me not so long ago and weighs eight penny weights to the grain - or in modern parlance 12 grammes. Edited by user Thursday, 9 February 2012 10:53:31 AM(UTC) \| Reason: Not specified Lammerlaw attached the following image(s):

kiwikeith		Posted : Thursday, 9 February 2012 10:55:36 AM(UTC)
Rank: Gold Ingot Medals: Groups: Registered Joined: 28/06/2011(UTC) Posts: 648 Location: hector Thanks: 359 times Was thanked: 230 time(s) in 154 post(s)		hi thats better than my monday i got 16.2grms in 5 hours you know where shifted about 15cubic met so that puts it about 1 grm per cub met

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