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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Friday, 13 April 2012 8:20:20 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: creamer Go to Quoted Post
Awesome finds Lammerlaw. The blackened GOLD thing is quite cool. I found a nicely shaped piece of blackened lead the other day ( Shanes Stuff #93 post) and it has a certain mystique about it. And yes (tho not black..) GOD is good.


Has your black lead been painted at some stage or is that 'just how it is' - the floor of my truxk at one stage was covered in hunks of lead I picked up on a beach that was heavily eroded including a big block of lead form a divers weight belt.

Mineforgold - it does pay to keep you eyes open - The old saying 'All that glitters is not gold' also sort of works around the other way 'All that is black and and looks worthless just may not be worthless' and in the case of heavy items that dont get carried away when removing the gravel they are well worth investigating further.

Bittenbythebug - yes life was harsh and especially in winter and to imagine that they had to cart all their gear and food and blankets etc in with them is hard to envisualize - I take an entire 4WD of gear with me...all the mod cons and home comforts except stretchers as I prefer to sleep close to the ground to keep warm.
Lammerlaw  
Posted : Tuesday, 17 April 2012 6:36:30 PM(UTC)
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Many of the old time miners also made use of products which were not only to survive through to the 20th century but also through to the present day...or at least close to it. Enos Fruit salts was something I liked as a kid and used to eat it like it had gone out of fashion behind my parents and grandparents back.

It was invented back in the 1850s by a bloke named James Eno - I dont know what else E noed but he did know how to make fruit salts as it was the favourite product of its type at the time and as a kid I loved it!

This bottle is another Gold fields pick up and form the assortment of bottles found over the years it makes us realise that once thew gold fields became established they miners did have a wide variety of goods to choose from.

It was really only the initial gold strikes where miners had to go without as there were no stores or supplies and thus they had to carry in their own, often taking only what thy could carry on their backs
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1864hatter  
Posted : Tuesday, 17 April 2012 8:13:09 PM(UTC)
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Ok you have me wondering, what are Fruit salts? The combinatopn of salt and fruit does not seem quite as appealing as you make it sound.
Sherbet comes to mind. Good posts too recently must take a bit of effort to take all the photos and write the story up!
And now....On sandy beaches and muddy soil, rings and coins await my coil!
expat  
Posted : Tuesday, 17 April 2012 8:39:35 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: 1864hatter Go to Quoted Post
Ok you have me wondering, what are Fruit salts? The combinatopn of salt and fruit does not seem quite as appealing as you make it sound.
Sherbet comes to mind. Good posts too recently must take a bit of effort to take all the photos and write the story up!


Sherbet was probably quite similar! Enos was one of many late Victorian effervescent health drinks, primarily made of bicarb of soda but with fruit flavouring to help make it palatable, the product was a powder which was added to water to produce a drink that was claimed to be a remedy for upset stomachs. We have similar effervescent 'stomach aids' today.
I once read an article by a person who studied the lives of the early gold diggers extensively and who suggested that the problems with keeping their meat and foodstuffs fresh for any length of time helps explain why such a huge percentage of the glass bottles left behind by them were either a) products that aided digestion or masked stomach ailments and b) products that helped mask the taste of the rotten meat (!), relishes, peppersauces etc . An interesting thought. Its certainly the case that most of the ornately decorated peppersauce bottles so highly prized by collectors today have been recovered from the goldfields.



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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Tuesday, 17 April 2012 9:46:46 PM(UTC)
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Enos Fruit salts was the most successful of the 'fruit salt' products and you are both ever so right when you likened them to Sherbert - you not only hit the nail clean on the head but you also mentioned exactly what I was thinking as I wrote the last contribution above as Sherbert was something that my mother told me of as being a favourite of hers as a kid and when she saw some in a shop when I was a wee fellow she brought it for me but being a nosy wee guy I decided to smell it and it went up my nose...hell that was terrible. None the less I did like it and when ever I saw it after that I bought it. There is or was a similarity as Sherbert does effervesce like Enos did. If my memory serves me correctly Enos had a sort of acidic tang to it and I liked that. Yes indeed I was thinking of Sherbert when I wrote the comment to accompany the bottle!

I loved mixing the Enos with water though and watching it fix and swallowing it as it was fizzing - great stuff - mind you the things I like are - 1) generally not good for you and 2) generally hated by normal people!

expat has said a lot about the situation on the goldfields and only tonight I was wondering if I should continue the ongoing saga to look at Gold fields sauce bottles as they are numerous and also diversified and attractive.

expat - Iliked the comment about your collection but in my case to hell with my wife - I am begining my pyramid any time soon and I am going to get buried with all my collections - a bit like Tutankhamen!
mineforgold.co.nz  
Posted : Wednesday, 18 April 2012 10:44:40 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Lammerlaw Go to Quoted Post
expat - Iliked the comment about your collection but in my case to hell with my wife - I am begining my pyramid any time soon and I am going to get buried with all my collections - a bit like Tutankhamen!


You better set it up like The Temple Of Doom as I am sure there are plenty of Indiana Jones wannabes ready to chance their arm!
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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Wednesday, 18 April 2012 11:08:10 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mineforgold.co.nz Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Lammerlaw Go to Quoted Post
expat - Iliked the comment about your collection but in my case to hell with my wife - I am begining my pyramid any time soon and I am going to get buried with all my collections - a bit like Tutankhamen!


You better set it up like The Temple Of Doom as I am sure there are plenty of Indiana Jones wannabes ready to chance their arm!


Not only do I have the curse of the ancients on my side - a good thing being descended from witch doctors haha - but in this modern day and age of sophisticated technology I am sure that with a bit of chemical persuasion set up in the right manner and various types of strategically placed artillery one can make thing difficult for the wannabe Indiana Joneses!

This next goldfields bottle is also a product which is still sold today and very popular. Not only is it sold under its original name but other companies also make similar sauces as well. Lea and Perrins Worcestershire sauce was sold from the late 1838 and was the product of John Wheeley Lea and William Henry Perrins - they were chemists and I will leave it to the imagination as to where their premises were! No prizes for first guess.

As a wee fella my grand[parents always had it on the table - I hate it on pies, meat or on any other thing but I loved drinking it straight! Some people tend to be different!

Edited by user Wednesday, 18 April 2012 11:16:22 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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creamer  
Posted : Thursday, 19 April 2012 1:17:56 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Lammerlaw Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: creamer Go to Quoted Post
Awesome finds Lammerlaw. The blackened GOLD thing is quite cool. I found a nicely shaped piece of blackened lead the other day ( Shanes Stuff #93 post) and it has a certain mystique about it. And yes (tho not black..) GOD is good.


Has your black lead been painted at some stage or is that 'just how it is' - the floor of my truxk at one stage was covered in hunks of lead I picked up on a beach that was heavily eroded including a big block of lead form a divers weight belt.

Mineforgold - it does pay to keep you eyes open - The old saying 'All that glitters is not gold' also sort of works around the other way 'All that is black and and looks worthless just may not be worthless' and in the case of heavy items that dont get carried away when removing the gravel they are well worth investigating further.

Bittenbythebug - yes life was harsh and especially in winter and to imagine that they had to cart all their gear and food and blankets etc in with them is hard to envisualize - I take an entire 4WD of gear with me...all the mod cons and home comforts except stretchers as I prefer to sleep close to the ground to keep warm.

The blackened piece of lead has attracted some questions, both from its shape and tarnish, which is what i believe it is, tarnished black-lead, from age. I dont think it has been ever coated with anything. Again, one of my favorite finds at the moment.
Im guessing that any metal can discolour with age if thats the word. Even GOLD.
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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Thursday, 19 April 2012 5:03:30 PM(UTC)
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Shane - all metals will either tarnish like silver does, oxidise like iron and lead though iron oxidizes brown as in rust, lead white and so on.

Brown or black gold is really a layer of impurities like iron oxide form having lain for years beside iron, whether iron as in nails and old shovels in the river, picks etc or limonite iron ore. The gold doesnt change - it only takes on a layer - just like paiting it with brown or black paint - the gold hasnt tarnished, it hasnt oxidised - it just has a layer on it.
What intrigues me about your lead is exactly what is the covering on it - is it something from the soil or sand, was it something like enamel paint, has a chemical reacted on it - I like them mysteries because it is great trying to work out what it is then finally discovering what it was and finding out that you were right...or wrong!

Similar happened in an American Cowboy Action Shooting firearm forum I am a member of - A guy presented this picture of an Antique Spencer civil war rifle or carbine butt stock and asked if anyone could help him with the markings - in the end after many replies...and guesses he got his answer - a definitive one and we all wanted to know along with the owner - the answer was really amazing! Same with Shanes piece of lead...now we want to know!

Edited by user Thursday, 26 April 2012 11:43:53 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Tuesday, 24 April 2012 10:49:44 AM(UTC)
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Another Gold fields bottle - these bottles are totally endless but interesting none the less - no human could possibly build up 'the' definitve collection of bottles - for two reasons - they are endless and also no human knows exactly how many variations and colour tones there are in many of the individual companies bottles - an example of this being a bottle site dealing with bottles from the Gold rush/Indian Wars and Civil war era - it presented just one manufacturers product with the comment 'So far six different patterns or colour variations of bottle have been brought to our notice' - this infers that there could be more - who knows?

This bottle however is one of the more mundane ones - unlike Dr Townsends Sarsparrilla Bottles which do indeed come in many subtly different colours and markings.

This bottle is simply another of those great quack medicines - great stuff though - competition in those days simply meant one company packing more Opiates into the bottle to make you cross eyed and insensible faster than the next company.

This bottle reads

AYERS
CHERRY
PECTORAL
LOWELL MASS

Mass of course stands for Massachusetts in the good old US of A

At the end of the day though none of the claims made by these companies came within reach of one company whose claims were such that one fellow went in to the local medicine emporium to buy a bottle of the product which we will discuss later to cure his mates broken leg! Such were the claims made by some of these companies that some people swallowed those claims hook, line and sinker. The cure probably came from the psychological affect of the medicine after all if you believe in something enough its bound to happen.!

Of course it could also be said that if you drank enough of this type of compound it really didnt matter what you had because you had forgotten and in a haze of opium induced intoxication when you are oblivious to anything and everything including the pain of the initial infliction for which you took it and the only thing you are actually aware of is the angels fluttering around the ceiling above you then the fact that you were quite likely to wake up dead next morning became more hilarious with every mouthful. The effectiveness of these medicines can be attested for by the numbers of empty bottles that turn up. What the contents were actually effective at other than addling the mind is a matter of debate and conjecture.

Edited by user Tuesday, 24 April 2012 6:13:54 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Saturday, 28 April 2012 10:16:18 AM(UTC)
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The last of the quack medicine bottles...for a while.

An interesting bottle is one which I picked up in the hills many years ago called 'Loasbys Wahoo' - its claims were quite humble compared with most as it concentrated on Rheumatism and joint pains so I have no doubt that it may have had some value.

The bottle is only embossed on the two sides
On one side the word LOASBY
And on the other side WAHOO

I can only wonder if such a name would be accepted today as it does have that quack medicine sort of label to it. Today if it resurfaced I think that people would merely be quizzical about the name then quickly forget it but it does indicate the mind set of those living yesteryear and society today.

Interestingly enough of all the patent medicines 'Wahoo' has the name most reminiscent of the Old West and the medicine men who travelled around the West peddling their wares but I have every reason to believe that it is home grown - it was widely advertised in the Australian and New Zealand news papers during the 1890 period and its originator or founder of the 'WAHOO PATENT MEDICINE COMPANY' Andrew Loasby lived in Caversham, Dunedin.

To me the fact that it originated in Dunedin. New Zealand makes it more interesting as it is not an Internationally known product like 'Davis Painkiller', 'Enos' or 'Lea and Perrins.'

Edited by user Saturday, 28 April 2012 9:12:30 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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crisyboy  
Posted : Saturday, 28 April 2012 2:36:01 PM(UTC)
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love your bottles very cool,
thats alot of gold youy have there.
expat  
Posted : Saturday, 28 April 2012 3:48:51 PM(UTC)
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Very interesting Lammerlaw. Mr Loasby certainly moved around a bit, several types of his bottle are known from Christchurch. I had a small aqua coloured medicine with the delightful embossing "stop it for coughs - ask Loasby about it" and with a Colombo street Christchurch address. Bottles are also known from here embossed 'Loasbys Benjamin Gum'. Your guess is as good as mine on that one!



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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Sunday, 29 April 2012 11:42:43 AM(UTC)
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Crisyboy

I like bottles but lose one or two now and again due to flying objects in the house, things dropping on them, dropping them, errant cats - 'Kill a cat and save a Bellbird' - I have so many that I had to bury hundreds on my place - thats the good news, I have plenty of spares - the bad news is I cant find where I buried them!

As for the gold - I used to weigh all I got but i the end gave up so would have a clue what I have any more nor what I have found over the years - I think I have got beyond worrying - I took friends up on Wednesday last and they came home with gold and I came home with none and yesterday took another couple of friends and gave all I got to them including a 1.5 gramme nugget...some how it dont matter no more because the smile they give is sort of like the Cheshire Cat grin...the only bad thing about that is the fact that I dont like cats!

Expat

Yes Mr Loasby is certainly interesting and I noted that his product was widely advertised in both Australia and New Zealand - at this point in time I think he must have had factories in both New Zealand and Australia - I was really interested in your comment about the varieties of Loasby bottles as I dont think I have any others beside this one.

Thanks to Mr Google Benjamin Gum is a gum resin used for treating skin problems - it may be the same as Gum Benzoin...Cripey I have learnt something new!

I noted your saying at the bottom of your contribution - 'My greatest fear is that when I die my wife will sell my collection for what I told her it cost me.' - Do I say "You miserable shit you" or do I say "Great Minds think alike" - I love it - Recently I have put labels on my main collector items with values...its just that I dont let her see the labels - in this way she wont throw the hissy fit until I am dead and gone. When she sees the labels she will also wish she never threw my toys out of the cot like she does now - but then again most men prefer to fondle...no I wont say that...instead of a Navy Colt in bed!

Edited by user Sunday, 29 April 2012 1:29:10 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

oroplata  
Posted : Sunday, 29 April 2012 1:13:38 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Lammerlaw Go to Quoted Post

'Kill a cat and save a Bellbird'


http://www.theatlantic.c...making-you-crazy/8873/1/

Lammerlaw  
Posted : Sunday, 29 April 2012 1:33:15 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: oroplata Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Lammerlaw Go to Quoted Post

'Kill a cat and save a Bellbird'


http://www.theatlantic.c...making-you-crazy/8873/1/



OK so theres another reason to encourage the demise of the common household Moggie...'Kill a Cat before they drive you insane' - actually most cats, having an instinct for danger, usually give me a wide berth so any madness I have has probably got more likelihood thave originated from a Cow and that particular disease hasnt got to Kiwiland yet...or has it?
Lammerlaw  
Posted : Wednesday, 2 May 2012 10:53:21 PM(UTC)
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The old time miners even had toothpaste - great stuff to and a pity that motor cars had not been invented as it was the closest to valve grinding paste you could get...in fact it might even have been better than grinding paste - most young fellows on this forum probably dont know what I mean as you buy a car today and at several hundred thousand kilometres sell it to some poor unsuspecting sod...like me! Back when I was just a wee fellow I remember my father grinding the valves on several of the family cars - British 1940s something or others...I think one was a 4 cylinder Vauxhall...today even the word 'Vauxhall' doesnt seem real.

In any case toothpaste containers are sometimes picked up in goldfield dumps where the miners dumped their rubbish. One of the most common is the Cherry Toothpaste containers - these were porcelain and came in a variety of designs some of which were quite colourful.

Some were square in shape but mostly rounded.

S.MAW and SON was one of the brands of Cherry Toothpaste and also one of the plainest but none the less still nice to have. This pot will date from the 1880 era and indicative of a miner who at least thought he was caring for the health of his teeth and not in the least aware that he was probably grinding them away - ignorance is bliss.

I have no idea why it was called Cherry Toothpaste but I assume it had a Cherry flavour - I do know that as a kid my grand mother bought me a tube of Cherry flavour toothpaste and I ate it all in one go - much to the disapproval of all and the consternation of the oldies who spent some time discussing the consequences of my actions and the possible affects of an entire tube of toothpaste taken internally.

There was also Carbolic toothpaste - now that stuff had to be good - Carbolic is a poison but it was used in such things as mouth wash...and apparently toothpaste as it killed bacteria. I always liked carbolic - it tasted good but then again so did old fashioned poultices and horse liniment - this probably accounts for my liking of Sarsparilla - which also tastes like liniment!

Edited by user Wednesday, 2 May 2012 11:07:00 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Sunday, 6 May 2012 9:47:44 PM(UTC)
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Another apparent favourite of the Goldfields community was the Hollaway products - Holloways Ointment and Holloways Pills. Over the years I have found a good many Holloways containers in my meanderings around the hills...I was always quite intrigued by the claims of Holloways. If their claims can be of any value then I am not quite sure whgy people ever suffer from anything except accidents and intentional self inflicted injuries or injuries involving others - and even then Holloways should have been able to cure the problem.

The Holloways oi8ntment containers shown here read

HOLLOWAYS
OINTMENT
FOR THE CURE OF INVETERATE ULCERS
BAD LEGS SORE BREASTS SORE HEADS
In Pots 1s 1 1/2d 2/9 4/6 11/ 22/ & 33/ Each
BY THE PROPRIETOR
244 STRAND LONDON

Its obviously great stuff. Between this stuff and the various painkillers and patent quack medicines the old time miners must have had a ball....but if Holloways ointment seems to be the miracle cure all it is nothing compared with Holloways Pills...more later!

Edited by user Sunday, 6 May 2012 9:49:38 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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mineforgold.co.nz  
Posted : Sunday, 6 May 2012 10:19:59 PM(UTC)
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I used to think the old boys were particularly hardy surviving in extreme conditions and moving copious amounts of rock without hydraulics - now I see they were human running on miracle cure.
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Lammerlaw  
Posted : Monday, 7 May 2012 11:05:42 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: mineforgold.co.nz Go to Quoted Post
I used to think the old boys were particularly hardy surviving in extreme conditions and moving copious amounts of rock without hydraulics - now I see they were human running on miracle cure.


I guess that it would be very interesting to know the statistics relating to alcohol consumption, the use of painkillers and opiates but I would most certainly think that there would be those who never touched a drop and those who were cross eyed half the time.

I think that the early gold fields were very sparten as far as choices and varieties is concerned but after the merchants arrived on the scene I daresay there was a very wide variety of goods on offer and this is evidenced by the variety of products I have attempted to present here and which I shall continue to do so.

No I don think they were on 'miracle cure' - just as we see today there were those who partook of products of nefarious and dubious value and those who didnt - yesteryear it was opiates and alcohol and today its wacky baccy and worse plus alcohol. No difference really...at least I dont think so.
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